Some clarification of x-rays and IVDD

[areese]

http://www.dodgerslist.com/literature/CalcifiedDiscs.htm

[Frzframe]

Yes, that's what I've known since Ruby Roo. Although x-rays did help us see that her back was a nightmare with 95% of her disc already calcified. :(

A on a side note I was wondering: Does dodgerslist address the likely hood of a dog that has undergone a back surgery of it having to have more surgeries? As it was explained to me that once a dog has back surgery it is not uncommon for the disc in front of and behind the damaged disc (which had the surgery) have to work harder and thus also in time might rupture. :scratch:

[areese]

Dodgers has some very biased stats they post about reccurence of back problems. they say it is like over 50%. But that is from data they aquired through self-report. So it is very biased. Cuz who would continue to read and report to dodgers??? People whose dog has recovered and done fine, or people with continuing problems?? There are a few people on there whose dogs have had multiple surgeries though. Our neurosurgeon said it around 10-20% of dogs that have another problem.
Laika's surgeon did a fenestration on the adjoining discs. They take the stuff that can herniate from the disc right out so it prevents herniation or bulging in the future.
I would think a dog that does not have surgery would be more likely to have problems, cuz that disc material that leaked out was never removed and they can have an inflammatory reaction to that in the future...for some reason (I guess cuz that material is always seperate and enclosed) a dog's body doesn't recognize that as part of itself and reacts to it like a foreign substance. But I don't know of any research that addresses this.
The discs that most commonly herniate are the ones where the thoractic vertebrae meet the lumbar (lower back) cuz it's the most flexible part of the dog. Hopefully, since Laika's herniation was between T 11 and 12 (there are 13) and he fenestrated the adjoining ones, she'll be ok.
I just don't want all the people here who have had x-rays showing calcifications to worry excessively. I've read over and over that the calcifications do not mean the discs in those areas will herniate. In older dogs of any breed, there will be calcifications, it just happens earlier with doxies. This is a good article but pretty technical and I had to re-read it a number of times to understand
http://www.dachshund-dca.org/discbook.html

Yes, that's what I've known since Ruby Roo. Although x-rays did help us see that her back was a nightmare with 95% of her disc already calcified. :(

A on a side note I was wondering: Does dodgerslist address the likely hood of a dog that has undergone a back surgery of the likely hood of it having to have more surgeries? As it was explained to me that once a dog has back surgery it is not uncommon for the disc in front of and behind the damaged disc (which had the surgery) have to work harder and thus also in time might rupture. :scratch:

[ebmw1975]

It is kinda the same for people too. You may see calcification or bulging discs on a xray or mri but that doesnt mean you will have problems from them or have to decide to stop living because of them.
It all people and animals the better you know about something the better you are to combat it. So if you or your pup have a not so right xray so what, do what you can with exercise, eating right and a good attitude, and if you have one then your pups will too.

[Frzframe]

I like to see some studies on it (if there are any out there besides the list) as I do tend to agree that dogs who have fused disc are more likely to have another surgery due to the extra pressure the normal disc in front of and behind that move correctly have to take on.

The area where Gunner is effected is his middle back so that is why we are 95% sure it was a turma and not IVDD that had him down. He by the way is even doing better now then he was when the snow video was taken. :)

[Lisa]

On the literature I got from Pogo it is 10 - 20% chance of re-occurrence.

[areese]

Well the most common area IS the middle back. I would say Laika's is pretty much right in the middle and most dogs have the problem in that area.

[Frzframe]

Well the most common area IS the middle back. I would say Laika's is pretty much right in the middle and most dogs have the problem in that area.

:) His is the upper middle, just below his shoulders.

[areese]

:) His is the upper middle, just below his shoulders.

I'm confused...how do they know? Since x-rays don't really show it and it seems like a tumor would have shown up though?? Or is turma trauma? :rotfl: That's what I was thinking with him..that he was dropped or something dropped on him.
I'm so glad he is doing so well. He is just such a special guy.
Speaking of doing well, Laika was outside today, ignoring me calling her (there was a bunny out there and she was mesmerized by the scent) and then I heard the garage door opening cuz Rob was coming home so I just said, Laika, Rob's home and she ran like a bat out of hell to the deck, made this huge flying leap to the ramp, hitting it about halfway up and galloped to the door. SO smooth and coordinated. She was FLYING. Not that I especially want her doing that but I had to admire the athleticism, anyway!

[Lisa]

:holyshp: That is scary :shocked: but so amazing! :cheer3: :cheer3: :cheer3: :cheer3:

Amy, I can never thank you enough - you and Laika give me hope and encouragement every day that we will make it through this too. :hug99: Your girl is so awesome.

[areese]

:holyshp: That is scary :shocked: but so amazing! :cheer3: :cheer3: :cheer3: :cheer3:

Amy, I can never thank you enough - you and Laika give me hope and encouragement every day that we will make it through this too. :hug99: Your girl is so awesome.

Oh and Laika's all nonchalant about the whole thing now. "Back Surgery? Oh THAT lil ole thaang. NOw are you getting the laser pointer out or what???"

[Frzframe]

Trauma. I meant to spell trauma. hahahahaha

We're not sure what happened to him but since we got him when he had been down for 5 weeks it wasn't going to hurt us to see how he would respond to other forms of teatment besides surgery (plus the rescue wouldn't out right approve of rushing him to surgery). What amazed the vet was even though Gunner had no feeling in his feet he was still able to walk although he was very wobbly. We feel that walking helped him gain back the feelings in his legs. First his right leg was the weakest and then over a few weeks it changed to his left leg and now they are about the same. It's been cool to watch his body heal itself. :)